Interview: Louisa Nicklin - 'The Big Sulk' Album Release Tour

An in-demand Aotearoa artist who has played as member of Dimmer, Mermaidens, Jazmine Mary, D.C. Maxwell and more, Louisa Nicklin's own songwriting work stands head and shoulders next to those acclaimed acts. Produced by Shayne P. Carter, Nicklin's exceptional new sophomore album The Big Sulk features eight entrancing, gothic-tinted numbers, recorded with bandmates at the time Mason Fairey, Eamon Edmundson-Wells and Durham Fenwick. Nicklin spoke with UTR roving reporter Liam Hansen (Debate Magazine, Clementine) about her unhurried attitude towards The Big Sulk, how to feed the whole crew during coastal recording sessions and more. The release tour begins this weekend in Whakatū / Nelson, Ōtautahi and Ōtepoti — brought to you by 100% Good...

UTR proudly presents...

Louisa Nicklin 'The Big Sulk' Album Release Tour

Friday 6th September - Nelson, Boathouse w/ Team Scary
Saturday 7th September - Space Academy, Christchurch w/ T.G. Shand
Sunday 8th September - Yours, Dunedin w/ Death And The Maiden
Friday 13th September - Moon, Wellington w/ Linen
Friday 20th September - Double Whammy, Auckland w/ Groopchat and Green Grove

Tickets on sale HERE via UTR

Liam Hansen: You were saying, listening to it over and over again makes you quite used to it, and it's like 'just the music'. Did you do much production work on it? Who did you work with for the record?

Louisa Nicklin: Shayne Carter was the main guy. He produced the album and we did a lot of pre-production together. I reckon that was the most valuable part. He was super valuable in the studio recording process. But all the pre-production stuff would it actually often be just like me and him, I would play the songs for him or send him little recordings and stuff. He'd give some feedback, then came along to some of our rehearsals and gave some feedback about how it could work as a band arrangement. Because I like it to exist as a band before recording, rather than going in kind of blind or whatever, you know.

Who's in your live band these days?

For the recording it was me and Mason Fairey, who's been there since day dot. Eamon Edmundson-Wells, who's also been there for a long, long time. We recorded also with Durham Fenwick of Green Grove. He was there for the recording process, but he's not in the live band anymore because he's just too busy with new work. So now Ali Burns plays in the live band.

Then for the South Island, Kat Tomacruz is filling in for Eamon, because he's got a baby and it's hard to go away for too long. It was really nice... because we first started recording in March last year, we went away for like two weeks and stayed at a bach. Eamon and his wife and his baby all got to come and hang out, they pretty much hung out the whole time. It was really cool being able to do that, because I liked the romantic idea of going away to go record. It's hard if someone has a baby, you can't go away very long. So it's cool to be able to go somewhere where they could come too.

Where was the bach?

In Whiritoa, which is near Whangamatā, like between Waihi and Whangamatā. There was no one really around. Just one neighbour, that probably could hear us and probably got a bit annoyed. It was pretty cool and we just ate sausages for two weeks, because I was recording and being the artist, but also kind of like the host / caterer. I just went for the easy option of just sausages, salad, potatoes every night.

Let’s start up a new holiday inn through there — Louisa Nicklin’s Fun Holiday Getaway.

Yeah! Hard out. It started as kind of crack up that we were having so many sausages. Then by the end of it everyone was like, "Are we actually having sausages again?" I was like, "There’s kebabs as well, but yeah, we're just doing BBQ again". Because it's just so easy, when there's all of you and you're busy... It was the end of summer, still quite nice.

Did you record much of The Big Sulk in the studio, or is it a home-recording type deal?

Mostly home recording. At that bach, when we did the drums we opened all the doors and windows, because otherwise it was too reflective, but it made it super scenic. Mason was playing in this room with all the windows and doors open, and we'd be sitting out on the deck listening, that was quite cool. We mostly did that more home recording DIY vibe and that was with Steven Marr, who did the first record. He was with us for the two weeks doing the engineering and then we ended up recording more at Tom Healy’s studio. Not actually with Tom Healy, but we just hired his space in September / October / November, something like that.

Basically we went away and I thought were going to record the whole album. Then I dropped Shayne off at the airport and he was like, "I reckon you should write some more songs" [laughs]. At first I was so gutted, but it was because there were a few songs that just weren't really landing. He had a good point you know, "What's the rush?" I wanted to release it last year, but what's another year or half a year or something, to make it something you feel really good about? So ditched three songs and replaced them with three songs. I'm really grateful that he gave me that push. It was definitely hard, I felt like I didn't have anything left in the songwriting tank. The next six months of trying to write, I managed to squeeze three songs out.

What did the timeline look like? How long had you been working on this record for?

I asked Shayne to produce, not middle of last year but 2022 and then we were making demos before that. Me and Mason and Eamon at like the beginning of 2022, some of these songs were demoed then. It's kind of been going on for a while. I got Shayne on board and I was pretty keen to record the album end of 2022 and I didn't even have the songs. But you know when you’re just like, "I'm just keen". Then we pushed it out to the beginning of 2023, then it was, "Actually I’ll write some more songs". So it was end of 2023 that we finished recording. It suddenly became this thing... Guess it's been a couple of years in the making.

That does seem fucking terrifying to have Shayne P. Carter tell you "Keep working on it, add some new songs". Do you tend to write as you go or is it like, "I need to sit down right now and write some songs" — a very sort of work-based process rather than one that comes out more naturally?

Nah, I'm not very disciplined with it. Some people can do that, where they just are like, "I'm gonna write a song, sit down and do it". I find that quite hard. So that six months of really trying to write some stuff, it's more the lyrics and the content that takes me longer. The musical aspect, instrumental aspect, I think, can come a bit quicker for me. I don't know, it's just something I'm more comfortable with maybe. Whereas, the lyrical aspect is a newer thing in my life — I've still been doing it for what, like 5-6 something years. But playing music is something I've been doing for a long time, so that that feels easier. But I tried to have some discipline about it for this, started doing writing in the morning or having really specific days, where I sat down and did writing and things like that.

It seems both with the first album and The Big Sulk, the tone and the theme is similar but very – I’m trying to find a way to not say it in a way that feels like "This is sad music and I love it," but —

Yeah, but it kind of is. It’s called The Big Sulk [laughs]. I reckon the name The Big Sulk is just leaning into all of that. Being aware that this is your big sulky moment where you can just wallow. And this is me, wallowing in my dumb shit for an album. Then I can put the wallowing to bed or whatever. I'm not actually that sad, but that's the output for all of the wallowing, the sulking.

I don't write with big themes in mind, with an overarching theme for either album. The name The Big Sulk more came out of the songs existing. Shayne and I joking about it being my big sulk and it wasn't actually gonna be the name. It was just something we joked about. “How's it going? How's your big sulk? How are the songs?” Then that was the joke name for the album and I was like, "I actually loved that".

It just stuck.

Yeah, it wasn't like I was writing them being like I want these all to be sulky songs. That’s just kind of what happened.

You say that you want the songs to be able to exist both within a solo capacity and a band capacity and a recorded capacity. When you've been recording with the band or practising, or just bringing the demos to them, has there been anything that they've added that has shifted your perception of the song necessarily?

For sure. I reckon the thing that can change it heaps is the drums. I could have imagined it being really sparse or something, then Mason will come in with something that's actually quite driving or whatever. It can totally change the feel of the song, but I like that. Sometimes I will not like that and I'll speak up about it, but I actually like that it is this little solo version that morphs and can be different when it's with the band.

Everyone does bring their little part to it. I think it makes the music more interesting, when it's a lots of different perspectives coming into one, rather than just me. I don't know if that makes sense. It's hard to talk about music and not just sound like abstract random wanky shit. 

When it comes to the tour that you've got coming up, are the arrangements for those shows going to be different to what's on the album?

Maybe a little bit, but not in a major way. I like giving people some creative freedom when they come and play with me. Had Jasmine Balmer (BEING.) playing in the band for a bit and she did the RNZ live to air thing we did together. That was before Ali had joined the band, but Durham was out and you know, transitional period — she's on tour with Princess Chelsea now. She has her own flavour that she brought, when she was doing these, sometimes it's quite ambient sound or tiny yucky little [makes high pitched bleep sounds]. Durham had his way of doing those funny little noises and bits and pieces. And then Ali has her way of doing those funny little bits and I like that. In some of the songs there's a bit more freedom for that, particularly when it is more a background, ambient noise.

You're really playing across the motu. It’s with 100% Good, eh? When was the last time that you took that sort of cross-country tour? Because it's been pretty Tāmaki-based so far, for the past couple years at least?

Yeah, yeah. For my own stuff, I haven't been floating around since the first album I think. All the other touring around the country has been with other bands. Maybe played some random shows in there, where I maybe went down to Wellington for something. It's been definitely pretty Tāmaki-based. It's exciting to go down to the South Island again and bring the band and do the whole thing.

I love being here and I love playing here, but going on tour is fun. Playing in different places and bringing the music to people that might not have heard it before, or don't get to see you play very often, or to even some family that live in Christchurch and wouldn't fly up for a show. It’s cool to go and play and they can actually come along. Or some friends or whatever, that are disconnected from that part of what you do. I'm looking forward to it for sure.

Did you grow up in Tāmaki?

I was here until I was eighteen, then I lived down in Pōneke for like five or six years, until my mid-twenties or early to mid-twenties, then came back here. I've been here quite a while now and I love it. Good place.

You excited to play Double Whammy?

Yeah, I went to the opening the other night and it was really cool and I feel good about it. It's a big room, but hopefully there will be some people who will come to and it'll be great. It will be cool to play there. Somewhere that's kind of familiar, but kind of new. It's new but it's also had a month.

Any plans for new musical things that people should be excited for?

Just this yeah. Album, album tour, come support. Next thing: TBC.

'The Big Sulk' is out now on major streaming platforms, vinyl LP orders available via Bandcamp and Flying Out.

Liam Hansen's new emo-indie-punk project Clementine plays with Babe Martin and Work at Sunreturn's next Primer. event at 605 Morningside Drinkery on 28th September — snag tickets HERE.

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.